From Shy to Confident: Philip Sessions on Communication Mastery and Confidence

Tim: 0:38

Welcome to Speaking with Confidence, a podcast that’s here to help you unlock the power of effective public speaking. I’m your host, tim Newman, and I’m excited to take you on a journey to become a better public speaker. Today’s guest is Philip Sessions. He’s a Christian husband, girl dad and the most persistent person you’ll ever meet. Philip went from being the shy, quiet guy to one who commands any room he enters. Through his persistent efforts and transformative communication methods, he has helped hundreds of business owners build confidence and clarity in their speaking, which has transformed their lives and businesses. Philip is an engineer by degree. He learned in his early corporate years the power of communication and has leveraged that to do more of what he truly enjoys, which is helping people. So welcome to the show and a couple things. Number one I can’t believe that you were ever shy and I love that you’re a girl dad, so welcome. Welcome to the show.

Philip: 1:31

Yeah, tim, thanks for having me. And it’s funny with my in-laws. Same thing as my, especially my oldest one. She’s just super outgoing. And so they say, oh, just like Phillip. And it’s funny because my mom she’s like no, he was very quiet. Actually I had three sets of tubes in my ears by the age of three and so I actually went to special ed instead of pre-K because I couldn’t hear and therefore I couldn’t speak, and I graduated after like six months. But just kind of funny story there, if you will, because I couldn’t speak or I didn’t speak and being shy like that wasn’t me when I was young. So now people see me and they know where you were shy or anything like that.

Tim: 2:10

And then seeing my oldest daughter and how outgoing she is, it’s like just like philip and like well, that wasn’t me when I was serving, well, that that’s interesting, that the tubes in the ears and and how that affects you know, um, our, our infant development and being able to speak, um, and that that actually does say, that does bring a lot in terms of, you know, our personalities and those types of things, especially at that young age.

Philip: 2:39

Yeah, but did you have brothers and sisters? Yeah, I’ve got an older sister and a younger brother. And one thing I was going to mention there with the development my mom’s talked about it. Obviously I didn’t know, but I had started kind of talking and then I actually regressed in my talking because of not being able to hear and, based on what the doctor said, it just sounded like more like that’s what people when they talk to me. It sounded like I couldn’t understand it or couldn’t hear it because of all the fluid in my ear.

Philip: 3:07

So I mean I just think about from our perspective, anything that happens with our kids. It’s like, oh man, do we get worried? I can’t imagine for my parents and God bless those people that and I’m sure it’s because you love your child, you know you had the special needs child and you’re dealing with that and I hope I never deal with that. But I know if I have that happen with my children, that I will still love them the same way and everything. But I can imagine as a parent having what you quote, unquote normal kid and all of a sudden they’re regressing and it’s like are they becoming special needs? Like what’s going on here, and you get worried about your child and everything, so I can only imagine how my parents felt during that time as well.

Tim: 3:48

Yeah, I’ve got a special needs brother. He’s my youngest brother, he’s special needs, um, but I mean that’s all I’ve ever known with him and I know I kind of know the story there and and some of the things that happened and but I mean he, he’s just my brother and that’s, that is what it is. But my oldest grandson was kind of you know I don’t know the full story with you, but it’s kind of in your boat just had to get tubes in his ears for some of the same reasons. And you can really see his development in terms of communication from the time he got his tubes in his ears, which I believe has been about six months now, to now how much more he is responsive and talking and really interacting really with everybody.

Philip: 4:36

Yeah, and to kind of bring that to adults. I think it’s the same thing when we learn how to actually communicate. I know for myself when I started learning how to communicate better and focused on you know what is the other person saying, what do I feel like they’re trying to get from this conversation, or just listening to them and and how they feel about the situation or what they’re saying, rather than listening to respond, I started noticing that conversations got a lot better and so that’s kind of the tubes in the ear kind of thing. We tend to do, that you know, we got the, I guess, cotton in our ears, cotton balls, we don’t listen, I’m not listening and I’m just going to say what I want to say, kind of thing. And those conversations and they’re not really even a conversation because of one side it always go South. There’s such poor interactions with somebody because we’re not listening. So we, you know we need to listen more in order to communicate better.

Tim: 5:29

Yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s funny, that’s.

Tim: 5:31

It’s kind of kind of our political situation right now.

Tim: 5:34

Right, Nobody wants to listen to anybody else, and what I tell people is I say, if you just actually be open to listening to what somebody else has to say, you may actually learn something.

Tim: 5:43

You know, you may jog your brain to think about something from a different perspective. You may actually be able to change somebody else’s mind if you’re listening to what they’re saying. And you know that goes really across the board in pretty much anything that we do. You know, as me as an educator, and I try and tell my students these types of things if you listen to you know your classmate, if you listen to me, if you listen to other educators, and then you go and you go out into the workforce and maybe what I say doesn’t necessarily fit, and then you’re going to actually maybe learn something for the way this person over here is doing it and or maybe you can say I’ve tried it this way or what have you. But you know, if we don’t actually listen to what other people are saying, this is really what we get in society, is what we have right now.

Philip: 6:36

Yeah, yeah, exactly. And then the other side or two and this is an example of somebody that I know they grew up with some friends in school and one time because they had just heard at church and everything that, hey, you have to be baptized in order to be saved and if you’re not baptized you’re going to hell, and all this stuff, and as a child they didn’t understand how to have that conversation. But because they basically told their friends because they weren’t baptized they were going to hell, at a younger age their friends wouldn’t talk. When religion came up they couldn’t talk to their friends anymore.

Philip: 7:13

And it’s a sad thing in that, not just with religion, I mean religion, politics, I think, are those big touchy subjects, if you will, that a lot of people don’t want to talk about and get easily offended by, which a whole different subject on that of why I think that is.

Philip: 7:34

But when you have conversations like that, you never know how detrimental that is to the what could have been a relationship that you have with somebody. So the way we communicate, even if we believe in something, even if it is completely true, the way we communicate it to somebody, we have to be gentle with that truth, especially something like if we go back to the religious thing like, hey, you’re going to hell because you don’t believe this way or you didn’t do this thing thing. If we go back to the religious thing like, hey, you’re going to hell because you don’t believe this way or you didn’t do this thing, whoa, like that’s. That’s a harsh way to say it. Even if it is true, we still have to say it in a loving and kind way and then help the person come to understand that.

Philip: 8:07

I mean and of course there are times where it’s like Nope, this is it, this is what you have to do. It’s cut and dry and I go back to my manufacturing days with that and it’s all about that. But there’s time, there’s a time and a place for that. But the more we can just learn how to communicate the way the other person wants to communicate, the better it’s going to be.

Tim: 8:24

Exactly. And you know, if you have to be baptized, be saved. I would spend my entire life at the at the altar, being baptized. I mean, you know we do stupid stuff all the time and you know, and it’s funny, just you know that’s part of being human, right, yeah, and accepting it and owning it and moving on, but it’s I don’t know. So let’s talk about your speaking journey. So you know, I learned something already the tubes. But you know, how did you really transition from being shy and quiet to where you are today? I mean, talk about the whole gamut, the good, the bad, and when you actually realized that you were really good at this, because you know your energy and your presence, you know, is big. I mean, I’ve seen you, you and I have communicated in the past, I’ve seen you in other videos and I’ve listened to other podcasts that you’ve done, and when you, when you start talking, you can feel that that presence, you can, you can feel that energy. So so talk about your, your entire journey.

Philip: 9:40

So my entire journey. So we go back there. I guess three years old or whatever, with the tubes. Fast forward to third grade actually is where I can really think back. I’ve never actually shared that that tube story, so I guess it goes back further than I normally talk about. I’ve never actually shared that tube story, so I guess it goes back further than I normally talk about. But third grade I missed a day of school. I come back the next day and because I was so quiet, my teacher I said hey, what did I miss? She looks at me and I still don’t know to this day if she really meant it or not. But she said you weren’t here. Like that’s how quiet I was, that she counted me as being there, being present in the class, even though I missed a day of school.

Philip: 10:15

Fast forward to high school. I started kind of opening up to friends. Only Like I’d be more talkative with friends and everything like that, but outside of like my friends group I really wouldn’t talk too much. Going into college, I wanted to make a change there. I wanted to be more outgoing. So I started being more outgoing to people, except for when I wanted to romantically pursue a woman, and then I was still shy and introverted and wouldn’t talk to women in that manner, trying to pursue them to go on dates and stuff like that, and so it was still the shyness.

Philip: 10:46

And then really it was two jobs, kind of back to back. So I had one in oil and gas in the Houston Texas area where I was doing all of the commissioning on these LAX skids, which is lease automatic custody transfer basically counts the amount of oil that moves from customer A to customer B. I was going up to North Dakota starting these up and yet I was getting called a young, dumb engineer. I was the one getting blamed for all this stuff and I ended up getting laid off from that job but I just felt so little there. And then I ended up going to another job in Georgia and at that company it was another oil and gas company I would go into these engineering meetings and I was like one of four engineers and I had 90% of the talking time in the meetings because of all the projects I was working on.

Philip: 11:32

Now there were a lot like smaller projects versus the other engineers, but still in the hour meeting. I’d probably speak for 50 minutes of the hour long meeting every single week. And yet my manager would talk down to me time and time and time again. And that was finally a catalyst for me, because I went, because it was a small company. So I went to the president, which is basically his manager, and talked about it, like hey, what can I do? I just don’t know what to do. I feel like I can’t speak up. Anytime I say anything, I’m belittled and all these things. And basically the president was like well, I’ll talk to him, but unfortunately you’re just going to deal with people that are assholes. And I’m like wow, okay, welcome to life, right, people that are assholes.

Tim: 12:14

And I’m like wow, okay, that doesn’t make me feel good, yeah, exactly I mean, I guess that’s true, but it was just kind of this, enough’s enough.

Philip: 12:26

And I started getting into self-development and had been to a couple of business conferences, but it was like, finally, enough was enough. And so I decided, from that time that job on and this was 2017, 2016, 2017, somewhere in there that was going to make a change. And at that same time, like doing self-development, I thought about doing a podcast. I kind of put it off, and that’s where the journey kind of started to change for me, cause I went, I moved back to green, I moved to Greenville, south Carolina, went to Georgia, moved back to Greenville, south Carolina, and I had went to this networking event and asked them hey, how do you start a podcast? Cause I did, like everybody else, I had the podcast, I had an idea, I didn’t start it. And so I asked them and the guy says, well, just start it, just do it. And I’m like, yeah, and then, but then of course he gave me some good advice, luckily, but it was more yeah, just do it, which is really the best advice you can get. And so finally, I started just doing it. And so, through this, being tired, sick and tired of being put down going to these business conferences and seeing these speakers and how they could change a whole room. They changed my life and they changed the whole room. And then starting my own podcast was really the beginning of that journey for me to really get into it.

Philip: 13:34

So this was again 2017 timeframe, so it’s been almost eight years since I started doing my first podcast and everything and so from that point forward, just doing podcasts basically weekly since then I’ve had some transitions and stuff different podcasts and things of that nature and getting on conversations like this networking of stuff different podcasts and things of that nature and getting on conversations like this networking.

Philip: 14:00

Just finding ways to put myself in front of people, to have a conversation one-on-one or in front of a groups has really helped me transform and kind of the catalyst for me to really take it to the next level was actually an opportunity I had at BMW manufacturing, doing leadership and transformation, and so they actually sucked me in doing presentation skills and that was what kind of solidified for me there’s something here. Other people need this as well. It’s not just me and I had wanted to start to change lives and do more, which is why I wanted to become a speaker, so I could speak to the masses, but whenever BMW identified that need for their company, I realized this is something I could do outside of this and that was kind of the catalyst for me to really start helping other people and not just myself with that speaking. So that’s it. Try to be condensed, but that is really the journey for me to get into speaking and now being on awesome podcasts like yours.

Tim: 14:53

Well, I appreciate that. You know I tell people I’m just a regular guy. You know I don’t say big words, I’m really kind of simple and direct. And you know, as I listen to your story, there’s a lot to unpack but there’s also a lot to learn. I mean from just from a leadership perspective. You know your, your previous managers and even the owner of the of the company.

Tim: 15:21

You know being a leader isn’t just, you know, owning something or being in charge of people to teach and mentor and, for whatever reason, they didn’t have the knowledge, didn’t have the skills, didn’t have the time what have you to mentor you? And that didn’t happen. And I think that, for anybody who’s listening, you know anytime that you’re in a position where you need a mentor and the people that are supposed to be doing it aren’t there, search it out. There’s a ton of people out there that are so willing to help and they can be community based, they can be professionally based People. Generally people are very willing to help and they want to help. But you have to be willing to ask that question. You have to be willing to put yourself out there and say I need help, can you help me with this? Or what have you?

Tim: 16:19

And I think some of the things that you’re doing, especially when you’re put in charge of leadership development in BMW, which you know at the plant that you’re at, that’s a pretty big ask, it’s a pretty big task. Yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of people that are working there that are looking up to you and obviously you know you’re you’re doing a good job. What? What are you still introverted on a regular? You know, in your normal life, because you know, when we do these things, yes, we’re in front of people and yes, we’re talking, but generally, you know, the majority of people are are introverts, we’re not extroverts. So the majority of people are like us. You know, outside of doing these types of things and being, you know, the front person, we’re just kind of shy, quiet in the background. So are you still like that on a on a normal, regular basis?

Philip: 17:14

I would say my natural tendency is to go back towards that, but I know, with my goals, where I’m trying to go, that I can’t be that way. Typically when I get introverted is whether it’s a networking event or it’s around, you know, a group of people that I don’t necessarily know them all. I tend to find myself where I’m like oh, I’m good, I’m just going to kind of stay here, I’m going to talk to the people that I know or not really be that outgoing, and it’s really strange with, like, not not a networking event, but being at. I can’t think like maybe it’s like a friend’s birthday party, but there’s like a lot of other people there that like we’re all getting together or whatever reason we’re getting together, but I don’t know them all. I tend to find myself where I’m like yeah, I don’t really want to be a people person right now, but I realized that and I have to tell myself this all the time that the person I want to be has to go, do those things where I want to go. I have to be in front of people, I have to network with people, I have to talk with people, and the only way for people to get to know me is for me to get to know them, for me to start that conversation with them, because most people don’t want to have that initial start, and especially for us guys.

Philip: 18:28

The hardest one when you’re single, is going up and talking to a random girl, but it’s the same thing whether it’s a girl and you’re you’re trying to pursue them in a romantic way, or if it’s a CEO of a company or for whatever it is you’re trying to do. That initial start is so difficult. Hey, my name’s Phillip, but after that it gets, it gets easier. I’m not going to say it’s 100% easy, but it’s just that, going up and just doing that. And so I tell myself a lot of times that these things okay, I need to at least go talk to five people at a networking event. Okay, I’ve got to put myself out and do this. Or again, I try and look at my future self. Where am I trying to go? Am I trying to build my business? How can I build that business? Okay, I need to be talking to people. People need to be knowing about me. I need to have those conversations. Who does that person know that? I don’t know, and everything.

Philip: 19:17

And especially as we’re building up our business or really trying to build our own credibility, our personal brand. Usually the people that don’t know us are the ones that are going to promote us more. I mean going back to what you talked about. Obviously we haven’t known each other for that long, so you had no clue. I was a shy person, so you identify me as being this confident and bold person, but my family, people that I know from grade school, from high school, even they identify me as that shy person. And so for us to be able to change our identity, unfortunately a lot of times we have to be around other people, people that don’t know our past selves, and so that’s kind of a hack there for you to be able to do that. But you have to start getting to know other people because they’re going to be the ones that are going to start to promote you. They’re going to see you in that light that you’re trying to personify yourself as and I’m not saying be fake, but you’re trying to be a new person.

Philip: 20:12

If I want to be a good husband, I have to act like a good husband’s going to act.

Philip: 20:16

I can’t just oh, you know, I’m a husband, I’m married, cool, so I’m a good husband now, but then I sit around and I do nothing and I’m sloppy and then I just have my wife at my beck and call no, that’s not a good husband. A good husband is going to take care of the yard, is going to try and help with the dishes, is going to give a lending hand when the kids need help, and everything trying to be proactive. That’s a good husband. Of course there’s other things. I’m not saying just those things, but I am actively trying to pursue being a good husband. So whatever you’re trying to do, you have to actively be pursuing it and it’s not just fake it till you make it. It’s be it until you become it mentality, and so that’s what I try and do and that’s so. Yeah, I still have those shy, introverted tendencies, but I realize if I want to go where I’m trying to go, who’s the person I have to be to be that, and that’s not that shy person. I have to be the outgoing person.

Tim: 21:12

Yeah, I like the be it till you become it a lot better than the fake it till you make it Right. I mean, I think the fake it till you make it doesn’t sound real, it doesn’t sound authentic, but the be it till you become it, I mean that does sound more real. Yeah, I mean that does sound more real.

Philip: 21:29

Yeah, which really goes into what you mentioned about. Like I have the energy when I’m on podcasts and on videos and stuff like that, and I appreciate that compliment. I love hearing that that it means I’m doing the right thing and everything, and I’ve been working on that and trying to be more energetic on these things. But it really comes back to the intentionality because I truly believe that I am trying and I want to put this through how I’m saying it I’m trying to help people. Yes, of course I want to be able to build my business and be able to make money and stuff like that. You know we all have to do that to be able to put food on the table.

Philip: 22:06

But I’m more concerned about helping people than making a dollar today. I know eventually I’m going to make it and of course I need to make some kind of money. But I’m more concerned with the person and because of that and I equate it to commission breath people can sense when you’re speaking, when you’re trying to be genuine and authentic and nice and all these things. They can smell it a thousand miles away and it’s it’s commission breath, but it’s, you know, speaker’s breath. I’ll call it if you will.

Philip: 22:37

People can tell that you’re not actually being true about that, and so it’s about actually having the care behind it. That’s how that energy comes out when I’m speaking and when other speakers are speaking, because they truly care or they truly believe in their message. Again, going to salespeople, if I, if I don’t believe that this product is that great and I talk about it as oh, here’s the features and here’s why it’s so great, you’re going to tell I’m just saying it because that’s just the facts about it. But when I truly believe in it and talk about it from a place of of true belief, you’re going to believe in that product because you believe me, and so that’s what you need to have. You need to have that belief behind it, the feelings behind what you’re saying, for people to really feel that and get that energy from you.

Tim: 23:27

Exactly and and if at least I believe this, if that’s you’re, it’s going to pay off, it’s going to pay off. I mean it’s you know, you’re you’re not selling now, you’re, you’re, you’re, you’re helping people and in the end, you’re going to get so much more in return. And not that we do it, not that we help people for that return, but that’s that’s what ends up happening, because you’re building a relationship. Everything is relationship-based, it’s all people-based, it’s all in. You know, people talk about AI, this and AI that, and everything’s going to be AI, but at the end of the day, it’s still going to be about individual and personal relationships, and the better that you are building personal relationships, the better off you’re going to be, the better off everybody agreed, agreed.

Philip: 24:15

And you know you talk about ai. I mean I think about ads on on facebook or all social medias, this, that and the other, for you know, constantly cold dms, all this stuff. I get more business by having genuine conversations with people or knowing somebody who introduces me to somebody else. So I’ve had a relationship with the first person they introduced me to their, a friend of theirs, and now we have that mutual connection. I get more business from that than trying to spam the DMs, from trying to run ads and stuff like that, while those are things that need to be done and they are effective. I get more business from genuine connections versus doing cold connections or just going straight in for that pitch that sell and everything.

Tim: 25:02

Exactly I don’t know if you saw this article that came out probably two weeks ago the number of AI podcast hosts and podcast guests. When I, when I read, read that that that there’s like thousands of them, that that really kind of blew me away, that that there are, that there are AI podcast hosts and AI podcast guests, and I would think that you know people would be able to ferret that out Right, but maybe not, I don’t know.

Philip: 25:34

I mean and then the other side of me too, like I mean, if it’s a good message, maybe, maybe that that works, maybe it’s a good thing. I mean I don’t know, but I think it really should be genuine people. It’s kind of scary what I can do. I mean kind of another side to that, like there’s like ai girlfriends now.

Philip: 25:51

I mean and there’s people, people online making money and they just have some kind of ai account and these use usually sleazy accounts, if you will, or, yes, a triple x kind of accounts, but they’re making tons of money and it’s not even actually them because they’re getting. Ai is getting that good, unfortunately. But I still believe, at the end of the day and we kind of talked a little bit offline about the, the political spectrum and everything and how things seem to be shifting there’s become, there’s gonna become, a shift with that too. Like right now, ai seems to be the easy button. People are willing to go to that. It’s a thing, oh, it’s, it’s a cool thing, it’s the buzz thing. I think there will still a place for AI, but we’re going to start seeing more genuine connections be that thing. And we saw that with 2020, with COVID. We saw where people went from like, oh, we didn’t really want to connect, and now we want to connect more. And actually I think I’ve got a post coming up that’ll talk about this.

Philip: 26:52

But my wife and I were out to eat and we’re like, oh my gosh, that server was awesome. But then we got to think about afterwards Like she, she was polite, she smiled, she came by to ask what we were doing. But that was about it Like she didn’t really go above and beyond. She did some very basic stuff, but the the level of service now has gone down so much that anybody that does what used to be the basics is above and beyond almost, which is really pathetic. So I say that to say to anybody that’s trying to have genuine connections or trying to be genuine in their speech by you just doing the basics, you’re going to be leaps and bounds ahead of anybody using AI or people not even trying, or they just have that speaker breath on them and everything. So just be genuine and I know it’s a buzzword, but be yourself and you’re going to attract people. And it’s going to take longer, for sure, but it’ll be more sustainable in the long run it’ll be more sustainable in the long run.

Tim: 27:49

Yeah, and the payoff at the end it’s going to be much bigger than you could ever really imagine.

Philip: 27:57

Yeah, and the shift is coming back to. People want more genuine connections. People want to meet in person more. That shift is coming back. It’s just going to take some time.

Tim: 28:09

So where’d you learn how to tell stories? I mean because the storytelling is. It’s hard, it’s not easy, you know, especially when I talk about my, my students and my clients we’ll talk about confidence here in a little bit but they don’t number one. They don’t know who they are and they don’t even know how to express. You know their story. Everybody has a story and it’s not wrong. Your story isn’t wrong because it’s yours, but you just have to figure out how to tell it, to compel people. And I guess, at the end of the day, why is that story important and what is it that you want them to do with that story? Or to change your life, or what have you? So where did you learn how to tell stories?

Philip: 28:56

Really just getting reps in through podcasts and stuff like this is really how I kind of came about it and really just assessing what was I saying, what made sense, and then what I do now. Any analogy that I try and share. I go based on the audience. You know, what is the audience trying to get out of the message that I try and share? I go based on the audience. What is the audience trying to get out of the message that I’m sharing and who is the audience? And just to give an example, and so I like to use a lot of examples and analogies.

Philip: 29:17

So politics is always just an easy one to talk about. So if I’m in a room full of conservatives, I can talk about conservative things or conservative politics, whatever, and it’s going to relate with them. But if I start talking about some woke ideology, they’re going to be like, oh my gosh, who is this guy? Get them off the stage. They’re not going to want to listen to me. And so that story is either relatable because it’s a more conservative type story, or it’s unrelatable and really offensive because it’s a woke type story. Not that either one is necessarily right or wrong, but it’s the audience and how they’re going to perceive that message.

Philip: 29:52

And so for me, really, how I learned was through podcasts and continuing to tell my story and refine it and figure out how to say it better and more precise and which, I think, without you know, more compact and everything more concise and everything, but then learning to also think about my audience, rather than just, oh, here’s my story, let me blabble on for for 10 or 15 minutes.

Philip: 30:16

So what would be most beneficial for my audience and there’s little things I’ll pick up and take out, depending on who the audience is and everything and in the direction we’re trying to go with the podcast in this case, or what I want to go and have as a takeaway for the audience that I’m speaking with and so that’s really how I continue to refine and develop and change it based on that audience, because it’s not only just about learning how to start telling stories and really how stories are, you know, do well, is because it’s relatable to that audience. So really just getting the reps in first of all, but then start thinking more about your audience first and then. Okay, now how would this part of my story relate with that audience or what can I do to have analogies if it’s not part of my story to relate with the audience and my message at the same time.

Tim: 31:10

That’s how.

Philip: 31:10

I would do it and how, how I went about doing it.

Tim: 31:13

I mean two points that are so important. You know the the audience and repetition. I mean, you know, to me it’s always about the audience and you know go back to what you said about the podcast you just have to do it. You have to, you have to to start doing things and the more you do them, the more you’re going to learn, the better that you’re going to get you know, the more that you can refine that message. And you know it’s it’s it’s so important.

Tim: 31:41

You know there are certain things that we do and you know, just from an educational perspective, you know we just have to do right, you just have to go do it and try it and get better at it. And then there are other parts of it where, okay, we need to teach you how to do it and why we’re doing it this way, right, but you know, there’s so many people you talk to, pretty much anybody who’s done a podcast. They’ve heard oh, I wanted to do it here and I didn’t do it, and I didn’t do it and I kept putting it off and somebody said just do it, and that’s. There are certain things you just have to just do and figure it out as you as you go along and get better at it as you go along. And so, you know, I’ve got another podcast with this one that I’ve been doing for a couple of years. This one just started in February, so almost a year old. And in doing this, you know talking about, you know, professional development and talking about becoming, you know, better communicators.

Tim: 32:42

What I’ve found is that there are so many people in the coaching space that come from engineering backgrounds. I mean, it’s incredible. I would say probably one in five people, maybe even more than that, that come from engineering. And you know, I tell people all the time that I’m a marketer, public relations guy, what we do is not rocket science, it’s about talking to people, it’s about building relationships, right, and I say it’s not rocket science. And then, you know, I met a new friend who’s an actual rocket scientist, who’s now helping people you know become better public speakers, and had a good laugh. I said you don’t have to be a rocket scientist to do this. But, excuse me, and I think what it is is because of the content and the way that engineers and STEM professionals think about things. That type of information is really difficult to share for the lay person, and so you have to find ways to do that. Why do you think that is?

Philip: 33:51

I actually didn’t know that a lot of engineers ended up becoming coaches, but I know. For me that’s what helped me excel in my career, because I have a background in controls engineering, which is, and my wife when I say, or when I talked about doing this, she’d be like I. My wife when I say, or when I talked about you know doing this, she’d be like I don’t know what he does there. But basically I automate the process of how cars are built. So I go in and create a program that tells devices when they can and cannot move and it’s monitoring them at all times and stuff like that. And so I had to find ways to build, to quote unquote, dumb down what was going on, especially to management. And I found, as I was able to start communicating that better, that people would come to me more to ask those questions. So they won, they knew I knew what I was talking about from the technical side, but they could come to me and understand what the actual issue was, because, especially in these big corporations, you’re always answering to somebody. So you need to have the information because, unfortunately, as you go higher up, you know less and less technical stuff or you understand less and less of that technical nitty gritty stuff, and so they have to be able to explain it in a way. So I guess, kind of naturally, just through learning to communicate better, I found out how to actually think about. How is my audience going to perceive this? What is their background knowledge on this? And so if I say control systems or PLCs, most audience probably like what in the world is that? A PLC is a programmable logic controller or an industrial computer in other words. And so, like you know, talking through this and learning how to speak with people like that are non-technical people, I guess was really just how it kind of helped me with my engineering side of things and then helped me really grow and develop my career, which again goes back to how speaking helped me out. And I think that’s why, because you have the technical aptitude and you can think logically as an engineer. But then you, if you’ve gotten to that point where you’ve grown beyond just engineering, you’ve learned to kind of communicate, you can then become a better coach, because now, yes, you know the technical stuff and really with engineering it’s all about learning and applying and then literally reverse engineering things, and I think that’s why they become and I didn’t realize. Like I said, I didn’t realize it was one in five that were engineers.

Philip: 36:14

But it makes a lot of sense because we’re able to take data, we’re able to take information and parse it out, reverse engineer it and say here’s what you should do, here’s your steps. Is that’s a lot of what we do on a repetitive basis. We try and figure out a way to create a process out of things, rather than this oh, we’ll figure it out, we’ll just kind of do it. No, we’re always trying to streamline things and that’s just how our mind thinks. So, going into the coaching space, whether it’s speaking business, whatever it is, we can take that information and understand it in some way, shape or form. And I’ve talked to my wife about this because I’m like, yeah, you know, I work on stuff all the time. I have no clue what I’m doing, but I have to figure it out Right. And so, as a coach, you’re coming in not knowing a lot of the background information on the business, not knowing a lot of background information on the person, but as an engineer, you’re used to that already. So you’re able to take very little information and be able to figure out some kind of process, some kind of plan and you’re able to problem solve through that. And so I can see why so many engineers become coaches because of that, because they have the aptitude for it.

Philip: 37:21

Those are used to not having a lot of information and making something happen. I mean, I’ve had plenty of jobs as well where you go in and you’re like, hey, can you fix this? I’ve never seen this system before, I’ve never been in the program. But yeah, yeah, I’ll figure it out. And you just go in and you start looking around and of course, the management’s sitting there. Well, aren’t you done, dude? I’ve never even seen this thing before, I don’t even know what this is, but I’m figuring it out for you. And then you figure it out and they’re like, oh, my gosh, that was great. And it’s like, yeah, okay. And then you move on and you might not even do that ever again, but you had to figure it out kind of on the fly. And so I think that’s why to me you know, just thinking about it here in the moment that’s probably why a lot of coaches are engineers, because they can problem solve and they can take small amount of information. And they can take a small amount of information and actually make something out of it.

Tim: 38:10

Yeah, that’s kind of my thought too. You ask questions, right, and then you can process that information and then ask other questions. The critical thinking ability to build on things and to get to the point. And, if you think about it, you got kids and you’ve got to. You’re you’re teaching these kids from teaching them how to eat, teach, teach them how to use a fork, right, yeah, and you find ways to do that. Sometimes it’s it’s you know, it’s, it’s trial and error. You teach them how to read. You’re teaching them how to get dressed, teach them how to tie their shoes. These are all processes and require communication from you as a parent to a child, an infant, a toddler. What have you that? You’re teaching them brand new things and you’re finding ways to make that connection for them.

Philip: 39:11

Really, this is no different, it’s just on a bigger scale, with a bigger scale, with more money, with more technical issues and problems yeah, exactly yeah, just find finding ways to be able to, to talk through that and help somebody with that next step, because everything has some kind of process. It’s, and it seems like a lot of people want to kind of start in the middle, Like, no, let’s, let’s either start at the end and reverse our way back or let’s start at the beginning and go to the end. It’s, it’s not about starting in the middle and we’ll kind of go each way and figure it out Like and and. But unfortunately, too many people want to do that. Right, you need to figure out from the beginning what’s going on and, like you said, asking those questions. I mean, as a coach, it’s such an important thing to ask questions for clarity. Those clarifying questions get more clarity on it. What’s happening, what happened before this to get us to this point?

Tim: 40:07

And you know where was either where was the disconnect or where was the light bulb moment and say that, wow, this is the right thing that we should be doing. You know, that’s more how I look at it. Let’s go back and figure out where to start. What were the steps? How did we get here? Now, I can, I can go backwards, but I would much rather start at the beginning and then and then figure it out. That way too it’s. You know, we, we all process things and think about things differently, but I’ve never been a person to start in the middle and go to me. That just doesn’t make any sense.

Philip: 40:58

Yeah.

Philip: 40:58

Well, I mean even with speaking. I’m sure you’ve had this question. You know what can I do to get better at speaking. You know this, that and the other. It’s like, ok, well, you can answer the question. Ok, hey, you know, get your phone out, start doing videos. Or, you know, have vocal variety, this, that and the other. You can list off so many things. But that person might not actually need to worry about vocal variety, or they may not have a lot of ums and ahs, or they may actually look at the camera when they’re talking instead of looking at the screen to simulate eye contact if it’s on video or whatever. They might not have those things. So you need to just start.

Philip: 41:35

So those that are trying to get into speaking, trying to get better at speaking, start speaking, start doing these videos, whether you just record it and leave it on your phone or you actually post to social media or you start doing a podcast. You have to get started so you can know what you need to actually work on. Because if I do a video and I’m flawless, I never say an um and ah. Well, why do I need to go search a video? How to remove filler words? I don’t. So you got to start somewhere and know your baseline and then you can start working on those things. So even if, before going to a coach, figure out what those things are and your coach should start with that, hey, let’s get some videos together.

Philip: 42:14

Show me show me how you speaking and then we can start talking through that. Hey, let’s get some videos together, show me, show me how you speaking and then we can start talking through that. But unfortunately and I think there’s a lot of coaches that just want to hear if we’re going to start this or you’re going to you talk about your marketing background, okay, rather than saying, hey, so what are you doing for marketing right now? Okay, you need to start running ads and we need to get your SEO together. And when you know, when you get that website revamped, blah, blah, blah, like all these things. But actually I don’t even have a website, so we need to build it. I can’t revamp it. Or I don’t have SEO because I don’t have a website. There’s all these things Like okay, so where are you at? We need to figure out where you’re at first so we can know those next steps. And unfortunately, especially with speaking, people want to know how to get better at speaking, but they hadn’t even started, right?

Tim: 42:55

So you’ve got to get started. Yeah, and you know, when I first started, you know, when I was teaching, I kept telling the students you got to stop the uhs and the ums. And I just kept kept telling them that. And then finally somebody said you keep telling us that, but you don’t tell us how. And that was a light bulb moment for me. You know, because you know, for me it’s just you just do it right, you just and that’s had to show them the process of you know, the us and the ums are a function of preparation and confidence. Yes, and so how do we, how do we prepare and how do we become more confident? Now we have something we can actually talk about and work on to get better at. It’s not just stop doing it right.

Philip: 43:41

Yeah, exactly, exactly. I was going to say that, like that’s the thing, when you know what you’re talking about, you’re going to have I mean, we’re all naturally going to have the ums and ahs. I’m sure you and I both have said several of those in this podcast. Both have said several of those in this podcast. Now it’s a little bit ad hoc. We’re not scripted here, so it’s not as much.

Philip: 44:00

I mean, so you’re going to have those, but when you know what you’re talking about, especially when you’re going on a stage, you give a keynote, you should know what you’re going to talk about. So a lot of those ums and ahs should not be there, because one, you know what you’re talking about. But but to that preparation, like you said, if you’re prepared and you know what you’re going to talk about, I would say 99 of them should be gone. That’s usually we don’t like silence, so you got to get comfortable with silence too. But it’s usually because we don’t know what we’re going to say next. And then, because of not being comfortable with silence, uh, and then you start talking again because you just want to have something there to fill in the void of silence.

Tim: 44:39

Right, and that’s that’s it. And I like also, like we said, be comfortable with silence. Yeah, you know, the idea of silence and pause is teaching them how powerful they can be used, how powerful they are if they’re using, you know, in the right spots. But that’s you know. That’s’s different discussion for a different day. Yeah, yeah, you know. So how do you help people build confidence? Because, you know, I mentioned it you know, most young professionals don’t spend any time really and maybe I was the same way thinking about who they are as an individual, who they are as a person. You know what are their values, you know those types of things, and their confidence level in themselves is so low. How do you help them, you know, actually build confidence?

Philip: 45:27

Twofold here. So one really start getting them to get reps in when it comes to, especially on the speaking side, get reps in with speaking, doing videos, when it comes to, especially on the speaking side, get reps in with speaking, doing videos. But then the other side of this is a mindset shift. You feel like you don’t know a lot about something because you know how much you don’t know. And I’ll give a good little engineering example here. A lot of people I’ve been doing some interviews here lately and asking like hey, you know where do you rate yourself as far as like Microsoft suite or Google suite, when it comes off all the tools there and they’re like oh, you know nine out of 10, but I know there’s some more I can learn. And I started thinking about for myself like where would I actually rate myself at? And honestly I’d probably rate myself like a six or so because I know how much I don’t know, especially when it comes to Excel. There are so much in Excel and I’m always having to go Google, okay, how to do this in Excel. So I realized that while I can be proficient on a basic level, I know there’s so much more that I don’t know. And I say that to say.

Philip: 46:33

A lot of times this lack of confidence comes in because when you’re an expert in a certain area, you realize just how much you don’t know and you feel like, well, I can’t teach that because I haven’t mastered it completely. But teaching something to other people most people you know, the general population the things that are basic to you are really not even basic. That’s probably like a 201 or a 301 class for them. They need something even more basic than that, and so I really try and instill the confidence. But let them understand and know what’s basic for you is actually what people need from you.

Philip: 47:16

They don’t need that next level, which is what you’re trying to learn, unless it’s all people that are on your same level. Then, yes, they’re going to need that next level, but you’re probably not going to be teaching them. But if you’re teaching somebody, it’s typically the things that are more basic to you now, and I like to think about that framework of something that your two or three year younger self you wish you would have known. Then those are the types of things that you’re teaching and not necessarily what you don’t actually know right now. And so it’s the twofold one getting reps in, but two shifting that mindset to understand that it’s really the basics that you’re teaching on, not necessarily that advanced stuff that you have finally just started learning that most people want to and need to learn from you. On whatever subject is that you’re teaching on, yeah, that’s so critical to understand.

Tim: 48:11

I also think it’s important for those people that you’re teaching this subject matter to, to see you as the professional or the master, the teacher whatever you want to call it the expert that they see you getting better in certain areas as well. They see you go through the struggle. They see you go through the process of trying to get better. You go through the struggle, they see you go through the process of of trying to get better. And you know, as a for example for me, you know, six, seven months ago, I couldn’t take a selfie because I don’t know where to look. You know, and and my, my excuse was well, men don’t, men don’t do that. That’s not what men do. You know we’re not meant to do pouty lips. So, you know, just duck lips. But you know, since starting this podcast, you know I’m doing these videos, I’m on camera a lot and you know I’m practicing and getting better. And they see this, they see this progression and they see that it’s work. They see the reps and it doesn’t just happen overnight.

Tim: 49:18

Anything that you want to be good at takes time and effort. I mean, it’s the whole idea of 10,000 hours. You know, go back to you know again. I come from the sport industry, so I go back to you know, the all-time greats Kobe Bryant, michael Jordans, tiger Woods, tom Brady’s how much time did did they practice and practice the fundamentals and go over and over and over and over? And even when they were playing, you know, before, up until they retired, they still practice fundamentals over and over again. Getting those reps in Speaking is no different. You have to be able to do that.

Philip: 50:01

Yeah, completely agree there. Yeah, getting those reps in. And I think about I saw some videos the other day. I was going through like YouTube trying to put more videos that are on that I was a guest appearance on for podcasts and everything into a little folder on my YouTube channel and I was seeing one from like three years ago. I’m like, oh man, I forgot about that one and then I started watching a little bit. I’m like, oh my gosh, like ah, I sounded terrible and it’s just constantly we’re getting better and we’re learning more and we’re finding new ways to be better at that.

Philip: 50:35

So if you’re trying to get into speaking, you just got to get started and I found the easiest way for me is one podcast, like guesting on podcasts, but more importantly that, doing your own solo episodes. When I started doing my own solo episodes, that helped me be able to start to articulate a message and have bullet points that support that overall message and learning how to go from speaking and oh man, it felt like this was forever and I spoke for three minutes on a topic to being able to start speaking for 10 or 15 minutes and really beyond that, like I can kind of. Okay, here’s an idea and I can start speaking on it for about 10, maybe to 15 minutes, depending on the subject, without preparation. But if I start preparing I can get 15, 20 minutes easy. And doing a podcast episode is a lot different than going to speak on stage, because it’s something you typically have down more but I can speak for a lot longer.

Philip: 51:27

But before that was really doing videos. So my two suggestions if you’re trying to get better at speaking, start making video content for social media, because people still, even though we see a lot of videos out there, a majority of people still are not posting videos. And second thing is start doing solo podcast episodes and then, if you want to get into the guesting realm, go and do that, whether you have a guest on your podcast or you go be a guest on other people’s podcasts. Start finding ways to be able to start speaking on subjects that you enjoy and talking with people and having those conversations. That’s going to help you so much more than studying and listening to podcasts like this to get better at speaking.

Tim: 52:08

Exactly. I mean, it’s, it’s, it’s so, so important. And I like the whole idea that you mentioned about you know doing solo episodes. Because you doing solo episodes? Because, on top of being able to speak that long on, you can, you can structure it so that becomes logical, so it becomes that story, so that it becomes um, something that people want to listen to, as opposed to just extemporaneously talk about things. Oh, and I forgot about this and I forgot about that and the other piece let’s talk about you know confidence from the standpoint of um, about you know confidence from the standpoint of volume, tone, enunciation.

Tim: 53:05

You know, I had a conversation with a student a couple weeks ago and I was trying to get him to explain something, something that he said he had knowledge in and he really did have some good knowledge in it. But I had to keep asking him to speak up. You know I can’t hear you. Can you repeat yourself? I didn’t understand what you said. How important is it to speak with authority? You know, speak so people can hear you. Enunciation, changes in volume, changes in tone to to really bring that message home.

Philip: 53:43

It is so important. And actually this goes back to one of the best pieces of advice I got early in my career from a manager who really wasn’t a great manager, but I was going into these companies being a programmer trying to figure out the problem, never been at the plant, never seen the program before, and he told me, no matter what, go in there with confidence and don’t let them know, even even if you don’t know in the moment, because you’re not going to know in the moment about the problem and how to fix it. Don’t let them know that you don’t know. And that stuck with me and so I always just went in that like hey, you know I can fix this, like yo, give me some time, I’m going to look at this and really kind of giving that plan. And so where was I going with that? So I would say that, having that confidence because of what he said, with that if you show that you don’t know what you’re doing, they’re always going to wonder does Phillip actually know what he’s doing? You could fix a million problems at their plant, but they will still question you every single time because you lack that confidence in yourself. And so when we’re going and speaking in front of people, you have to have that confidence.

Philip: 54:52

If I told you you know the sky is blue, if I said it like that, you’re like, wait, you don’t know the sky is blue. If I said it like that, you’re like, wait, you don’t. You don’t know if the sky is blue or not. But I said, hey, the sky is blue. I’m like, oh, yeah, the sky is blue, yeah, I believe that. Or if I was like, hey, the sky is green, like OK, ok, and you know, I thought it was blue. I mean, obviously needs to be something more. You know, not like that. But you know, if I come in with that confidence in my voice and I say it more as a statement, people are going to believe me more.

Philip: 55:23

And another example for you when you’re going in and I’m sure we’ve all done this when you’re going into some building you know department store, whatever it is and you go in looking like you know where you’re going, people don’t stop you. But when you go in there and you’re kind of like looking around, like oh, I’m not sure where to go, people stop you. Hey, you know, can I help you? Can I help you find where you’re trying to go? So it’s just literally that shift in hey, you act or you sound like you know where you’re going, so that confidence is imperative for people to listen to you. And so when you’re trying to present on whatever it is, you have to have that confidence in your voice and in your body language that you know what you’re talking about, that you’re here to deliver something for people. You believe in your message. So it’s imperative. So hopefully those analogies kind of helped explain that.

Tim: 56:11

Yeah, and when you said, the first thing I started thinking about is as a tourist, if you’re in a city and you’re looking around, you’re going to stick out like a sore thumb. So if you go to New York City, if you go to any major city, don’t be looking around, just walk like you got a purpose, go to point A to point B, and you’re not going to be targeted by all those other nefarious things. I don’t think anybody’s ever been to Vegas. You ever been to Vegas? Yeah, I’ve been to Vegas. Yeah, so you? I mean some of the stuff that goes on there. No, I don’t want that car, just just, just keep on walking, just keep on walking.

Philip: 56:48

Well, it’s it’s funny you say that. So I was in Scotland, I was on a work trip over there one time, but I was, um, I went to Edinburgh for, uh, just go for like a weekend thing and like not work stuff, and I was like I was heading towards the castle and it was so funny Cause like it’s really funny. But uh, I’m going there and I had my GPS out. I’m like okay, but I guess I look confident. I had a group of Americans stop me like hey, do you know how to get to the castle. And it was funny because, like, here I am, I’m from america, this is my first time ever and only time ever being in the country. And they come to me asking me and I’m like well, I’m american as well. They’re like, oh, we got a funny, fun laugh. But then I’m like it’s right there. They turn around and you can see the mountain now or not the mountain, the castle like how you got there exactly wasn’t directly to it, but i’m’m like it’s right there on top of the hill.

Philip: 57:36

It’s that big building over there, but it was just really funny because I had that confidence that it looked like I knew where I was going. These other Americans asked the American how to get somewhere. That’s crazy. That’s crazy.

Tim: 57:48

Yeah, confidence is extremely important. That’s us being Americans, way to go.

Philip: 57:54

We did it. We did it. Yeah, that’s us being Americans.

Tim: 57:56

Way to go, we did it, we did it. Yeah, so is there anything that we didn’t talk about that you think audience should know about?

Philip: 58:02

No, I think. I think that, especially for confidence type stuff, I think we really covered everything. I just want to emphasize again just get started. It’s the most annoying piece of advice, but it’s really the best piece of advice. Or, as Nike says, just do it. If it’s something that’s on your mind, go ahead and do it, because you’re going to start thinking about it and you’re going to overthink it, and then you’re going to procrastinate and it’ll be six years later and somebody else will say the same piece of advice. So, just get started, because for you to get to where you want to go, you have to do things that you’re not doing Now. You have to start doing things that your future self will be doing. You know again, be it until you become it. Start acting in a manner of the person that you want to be, and eventually you’re just going to be that person.

Tim: 58:53

Exactly so. You also have a lot of things, good things going on. Tell us about that. I mean, you’ve got the podcast, you’ve got your trainings, you’ve got your courses. Tell us about what you have going on.

Philip: 59:06

Yeah, a lot of things. So trying to get on more stages, more podcasts like this. I also help with public speaking coaching, but then, another endeavor that I have because of getting myself on podcasts and leveraging virtual assistants I actually started a virtual assistant agency, which is something that’s a lot of fun for me because it’s really a win-win-win, because I help pair busy people salespeople, business owners with virtual assistants, primarily from the Philippines, be able to get more things done, really buying back their time so they can focus on the things that they really enjoy doing, such as being on a podcast, rather than trying to reach out to everybody themselves personally trying to book the call that and the other. They can have a virtual assistant do that who’s happy to do that on their behalf and everything, and so that’s really the other thing I have outside of the podcast speaking sessions is the name of that podcast and doing the public speaking coaching and a digital course present with influence is that virtual assistant agency.

Tim: 1:00:10

And then of course the family.

Philip: 1:00:12

I guess I forgot. You know you brought up business stuff with the family as well. So three-year-old and eight-month-old, I’ve got my hands full there as well.

Tim: 1:00:19

Yes, you do, you know, enjoy that time with them because it goes by so incredibly fast. And I know people are going to think I’m nuts for even saying this and thinking this, but I’ve got three grandchildren now. The oldest is almost five. And it hit me and I don’t know why, it’s just the way my brain thinks. I said to my daughter last week I said you know, she’s halfway to being, halfway to being 18. And she’s almost five. I’m thinking this time flies by so incredibly fast and especially at that age they grow up so fast. And honestly, I was talking to my other daughter on the way in to the office today. Her son is. He was born July 7th, so he’s almost six months old, and I said you know, a week is like a dog year.

Philip: 1:01:21

Yeah.

Tim: 1:01:21

I mean they, they changed so so quickly.

Philip: 1:01:25

And.

Tim: 1:01:26

I was. You know I was. I was guilting her. I said I haven’t seen pictures. I haven’t seen, I haven’t seen a picture of him in a week. You know he. I mean, what are you doing? That’s your job as a mother to make sure that I’m getting you know pictures on a daily basis. And we had another conversation about technology that I had no idea about. So she taught me about, you know, whatever. It’s not really important, but I had no idea that she’d been uploading pictures to a shared account that I had no idea about anyway. But but you know, they take up. They take up so much time, but it’s, it’s joyous time. It’s time that you, that you want to be able to spend it with them. So please, please, please, enjoy it. But where can people if I don’t know? You don’t want people working with your kids, but you know where can people come and meet you and work with you to help get better public speaking.

Philip: 1:02:19

Uh, the place I liked the most is Facebook, so the real Phillip sessions and that’s Phillip the one L awesome. I’ll find me all over.

Tim: 1:02:28

I’ll put that in in in the show notes. And again, I really like you know that, that you call your business, which is speaking sessions. I mean it’s catchy, I mean I guess you can do that with your last name, but it’s awesome. Well, philip, thank you so much for taking some time with us today. I really, really do appreciate it. I think it was an awesome conversation. Yeah, thank you, take care, We’ll talk to you soon. Be sure to visit speakingwithconfidencepodcastcom to join our growing community and register for the Formula for Public Speaking course. Always remember your voice has the power to change the world. We’ll talk to you next time, take care.